Post by island65cruiser on May 14, 2020 9:27:59 GMT -5
Jim, from what I have read, the Apprehender frame was "heavily reinforced", but the article was vague as to whether it would be the same as a 442, or convertible frame. Unless you were trying to build a perfect car like RamZ's white car, who would care. It will be a clone anyway. The info provide by the guys on the site suggests that options such as A/C were available on the Aprehender. If I do it, I might search for a heavy duty frame, but it wouldn't stop me if I didn't have one. I would stress more over the under hood and interior details, like the correct air cleaner, or an antique Motorola two way radio head and speaker for the dash. Do you have a four door to sell?
Post by familyrides1965 on May 14, 2020 21:14:16 GMT -5
Agree, really was just curious if the 4dr would mount on a 2dr frame or if there was a unique heavy duty 4dr frame? As you suggested if they do work 2dr and 4dr, maybe a convertible frame would be what they went with?
Post by joepadavano on May 15, 2020 7:54:56 GMT -5
RPO F35 Heavy Duty frame was just the boxed convertible frame under non-convertible bodies. In the 1964-67 model years, all body styles except the Vista used the same 115" wheelbase and the boxed frame fit under any coupe or sedan.
Post by joepadavano on May 16, 2020 8:48:36 GMT -5
And since someone will likely mention it, the Heliwig frame boxing kit that is sold by Summit, Jegs, etc is not the same as a real convertible frame. That kit is just flat panels. A real convertible frame used contoured "C" sections welded open end to open end to the hardtop outer frame rails. The resulting section has significantly larger cross section and thus much greater bending and torsional stiffness.
Post by familyrides1965 on May 16, 2020 20:44:34 GMT -5
I understand tracking down a good convertible frame faces steep completion from convertible owners. I just sold a 65 442 convertible all original. It had a couple quarter size holes after I reamed out the pencil size soft spot on the rear rails just as they transition up. It was packed full of years of road debris. Yes, I disclosed the rust when I sold the car.
Would be a neat project, either way the replica/tribute you create won't be "correct" so worrying about the frame is a mute point, as very few will look at the undercarriage. Also the codes on the cowl tag will be incorrect and people will see those, unless you get extremely lucky to find a 4 speed car.
I have a 65 Buick Special 4 door 4 speed, started to life as a V6/3 on the tree, person I bought it from did it stock, so unless you ran the numbers would be the only way you could tell. I get a few looks, mostly old ladies unless someone spots the stick.
So unless you are outfitting the car with period correct lights, badges etc you won't get a lot of interest until they see a 4 speed, not to say it wouldn't be a wonderful project and fun, much more than a st300 auto, also even if ac wasn't available it is nice on a hot humid August afternoon
Post by island65cruiser on May 19, 2020 20:21:57 GMT -5
I tend to agree with jmos4. It would be nice to have the correct frame, but handing wise, a reinforced, upgraded Restomod frame would make for great handling. One of these days, one of us is going to make some reverse stamps to replicate 4speed cars on the body plate, which is legal and ethical as long as you disclose it, but would make the cars look correct to the casual observer for shows. It's not the VIN plate, so it shouldn't be a problem with DMV. Call it a Tribute, call it a clone, I would call it fun! I don't do OCA and other purist shows, so hopefully my sins would be forgiven. As long as your show placards clearly said it's a replica, what's the harm?
which is legal and ethical as long as you disclose it,
Ethical? We'll agree to disagree.
There's no reason to do this (or to print fake window stickers, or build sheets, or blank OW trans tags) unless you plan to deceive someone. The car isn't real, so why add to the illusion that it is? All you will do is impress the uninformed. And are you really going to stand next to the car and "disclose" it to everyone who looks at the cowl tag? Sorry, I'm not a fan.
Post by island65cruiser on May 20, 2020 21:44:20 GMT -5
I would call it out as a replica to anybody and everybody if it was my car. Can't speak for others. Also, for casual observers at cruise in's, and non organization car shows, I see nothing wrong with using a recreated window sticker to identify what the car they see represents, and the equipment on board. If you use an aftermarket, replicated 442 badge on real 442, does it make the car a fraud?
This isn't truly related but a good story. Back in the early 70's my Dad was a military police officer at Kirtland AFB in Albuquerque, NM. I don't know why but for some reason he had decided to moonlight as a security guard in the evenings. One night while moonlighting he caught wind of an armed robbery with two guys at a hotel near his location. After deciding to go after the guys he jumped in our 65 4-speed f85 wagon and chased them down the interstate through ABQ, he later said at speeds well over 100mph. They eventually pulled off the interstate and got in a gun battle at a big shopping mall off I-40. Unfortunately my Dad was shot in the process; with his gun drawn the bullet entered his left upper arm and went completely through his arm and shoulder. He then rolled under the Oldsmobile for protection. I'm kind of surprised I've never found any bullet holes in the wagon. Some guys in a near by service shop heard the gunfire and called the police. The two guys went to jail that night and my Dad went to the hospital. When my Dad woke up in the hospital the doctor told him #1 you should be dead but you're not, #2 you should have lost your arm but you didn't, someone is watching over you. Years later my Dad said he had just came back from Vietnam and was a little too gung-ho and probably shouldn't have gone after the guys, with a young family at home. He also stated, maybe in the late 80's-mid 90's, that the two guys had just gotten out of jail. His jobs in ABQ always required a lot of time at the military gun range and the wagon always seemed to smell of gun powder and munitions. One day while on the gun range with him he pulled out a big "Dirty Harry" 44 Magnum hand gun and said "I haven't shot this gun since the night I got shot". There were three live bullet still left in the revolver and he said, "what the hell, it's time to let this go". This was probably 20 years after the incident. I guess we have a wanna-be wagon police model.